Poll: Recruitment

[Orion1871]

I really don't get the Jacob hate. He started atrociously, and he still makes a few mistakes, but he's been perfectly fine most of the time.

For me, the best of a bad bunch of loanees.

Poor passer who loses the ball easily and hasn't got any pace to get back in after he loses it, which is a massive problem given how often he goes into midfield or is high up the pitch. Even if he gets near to the opposition winger he is beaten easily one on one. His decision making is poor (see failure to clear vs Exeter as a prime example)

I'll give him one thing. He is good in the air.

[stealthpapes]

So here's the list of players we signed in 2023-24

Harvey Knibbs
Sam Smith
Lewis Wing
Charlie Savage
Tivonge Rushesha
Harlee Dean
Tyler Bindon
David Button
Ben Elliott
John Ryan
Charlie Wellens
Jayden Wareham
Clinton Mola
Joel Pereira
Paul Mukairu
Dom Ballard

How many could be described as successes at November/December 2023?

Yes good point....probably only Knibbs & Wing in all honesty.

Smith took time to get going as was initially injured, Savage was inconsistent, Bindon was played out of position, Button was initially favoured over Joel, can't remember Elliott or any of the others pulling up any trees in the league.

Its too early to make a call on many of the new players as they have been in and out of the side and in my view been poorly coached and badly set up tactically.

ITALIC - yup, Smith first game was Charlton (A), end of October.
BOLD - Pereira didn't start a league game until March, Derby (A).

Given the time frame specified, I'd have added Ballard, but then he got injured and returned to original club.

[Hound]

So here's the list of players we signed in 2023-24

Harvey Knibbs
Sam Smith
Lewis Wing
Charlie Savage
Tivonge Rushesha
Harlee Dean
Tyler Bindon
David Button
Ben Elliott
John Ryan
Charlie Wellens
Jayden Wareham
Clinton Mola
Joel Pereira
Paul Mukairu
Dom Ballard

How many could be described as successes at November/December 2023?

Yes good point....probably only Knibbs & Wing in all honesty.

Smith took time to get going as was initially injured, Savage was inconsistent, Bindon was played out of position, Button was initially favoured over Joel, can't remember Elliott or any of the others pulling up any trees in the league.

Its too early to make a call on many of the new players as they have been in and out of the side and in my view been poorly coached and badly set up tactically.

ITALIC - yup, Smith first game was Charlton (A), end of October.
BOLD - Pereira didn't start a league game until March, Derby (A).

Given the time frame specified, I'd have added Ballard, but then he got injured and returned to original club.

+ Wing missed the first month injured and started slowly when back. Knibbs wasn’t rated at all by the fans to start as Selles was playing him wing and he wasn’t producing. He only really performed when he moved to CAM. Prob around October time iirc

[Hound]

In a way I think it’s a little unfair to pick out individuals - prob better to look at the overall signings in relation to the squad

I’d ask why do we have 4 capable senior LBs (Jacob, Garcia, Dorsett, Ryan), 3 RBs (Yiadom, Ahmed, Abrefa) tons of small lightweight wingers (Camara, DK, Lane, Ritchie, Tuma, Garcia again), 2 very similar CAMs (Elliott, Doyle), lots of young but senior CBs who arguably aren’t div1 level (Stickland, Borgnis, Burns, Dorsett) but no DMs (Fraser isn’t one) or big physical CFs like every other team does (Kelvin isn’t one)

[WestYorksRoyal]

The CF really is the unforgivable one. We sold Smith in January and had to make do under Dai, but it should have been top priority once the owners arrived, like the O'Connor signing at CB. Even if Wareham had stayed, he was not a top 6 CF (though he's better than O'Mahony).

How did we get into the last week of the window without one? And while Marriot has been good, he's not the focal point Smith was.

[Snowflake Royal]

In a way I think it’s a little unfair to pick out individuals - prob better to look at the overall signings in relation to the squad

I’d ask why do we have 4 capable senior LBs (Jacob, Garcia, Dorsett, Ryan), 3 RBs (Yiadom, Ahmed, Abrefa) tons of small lightweight wingers (Camara, DK, Lane, Ritchie, Tuma, Garcia again), 2 very similar CAMs (Elliott, Doyle), lots of young but senior CBs who arguably aren’t div1 level (Stickland, Borgnis, Burns, Dorsett) but no DMs (Fraser isn’t one) or big physical CFs like every other team does (Kelvin isn’t one)

Why do you think Fraser isn't a DM, people were crying out for him to be played in his 'proper' DM position earlier in the season?

Why do we have 3 RBs? We have Yiadom for experience, and Abrefa and Ahmed (who is a teenager) for development. Should we have released Ahmed or Abrefa given their potential? That would seem mad. And going with just those two would seem risky.

4 LBs? Dorsett is a player we seem to rate, but struggles with injury, and is more a CB long term. Garcia isn't really a LB and has been moved forward. Ryan hadn’t played a minute of competitive football. A more experienced dedicated LB was needed. Should we have just binned off Ryan as soon as he recovers from his year out? Seems harsh. Or Dorsett? Two positions down then.

CB? We were down the two first choice CBs, with very little left Burns we clearly expected more from. He's failed. We got in Williams, because Burns and Stickland showed they weren't up to it. Stickland was highly rated, I didn’t see it personally, but he's only really shown he isn’t up to it by playing. Borgnis we've barely seen. Dorsett already covered.

[Hound]

We’re not a charity. If Ryan or Stickland aren’t going to play then they should not have had contracts. Dorsett likewise if we assume injury prone. Yiadom, much as I like him also. We also have Clarke as a non playing LB/CB. Add in JOP who I forgot as a mini winger, that’s at least 6/7 contracts that could have been better used. That’s before we look at Camara and Rushesha etc

Or if we keep that lot we don’t sign Burns, Jacob, DK, Ritchie

Fraser was being played ahead of savage and Wing. Maybe he is best as a DM but that’s not where he was being played, and to me he looked better further forward

[Snowflake Royal]

We’re not a charity. If Ryan or Stickland aren’t going to play then they should not have had contracts. Dorsett likewise if we assume injury prone. Yiadom, much as I like him also. We also have Clarke as a non playing LB/CB. Add in JOP who I forgot as a mini winger, that’s at least 6/7 contracts that could have been better used. That’s before we look at Camara and DK, Rushesha etc

Fraser was being played ahead of savage and Wing. Maybe he is best as a DM but that’s not where he was being played

It's all very easy in hindsight Hound.

Yiadom has proved a good decision, he looks fit and is playing well.

Dorsett looks a good decision. He's playing ok, giving depth and covering two positions.

Have we got them all right? No. But remember, at the time a lot of the renewals happened we basically didn't have a squad. There's an element of getting bodies in not knowing what quality we'd secure later.

Extending Ryan, JOP, Rushesha, Stickland etc are not exactly big costs.

[Snowflake Royal]

Has Bindon made us forget that Academy players don't usually just walk into the first team as the finished article?

They usually take a season or two of gradual exposure to really settle in.

[Hound]

We’re not a charity. If Ryan or Stickland aren’t going to play then they should not have had contracts. Dorsett likewise if we assume injury prone. Yiadom, much as I like him also. We also have Clarke as a non playing LB/CB. Add in JOP who I forgot as a mini winger, that’s at least 6/7 contracts that could have been better used. That’s before we look at Camara and DK, Rushesha etc

Fraser was being played ahead of savage and Wing. Maybe he is best as a DM but that’s not where he was being played

It's all very easy in hindsight Hound.

Yiadom has proved a good decision, he looks fit and is playing well.

Dorsett looks a good decision. He's playing ok, giving depth and covering two positions.

Have we got them all right? No. But remember, at the time a lot of the renewals happened we basically didn't have a squad. There's an element of getting bodies in not knowing what quality we'd secure later.

Extending Ryan, JOP, Rushesha, Stickland etc are not exactly big costs.

Maybe not but were they only signed as worst case they’d play if we could sign anyone else?

As I edited in the post, signing them meant we didn’t need to sign who we did and should have concentrated our efforts elsewhere - mainly DM and CF. Just smacks of confusion and uncertainty renewing them but not trusting them

Rushesha is 23, Stickland and Ryan near 22. JOP 23 I think. Are we still unsure about them at this age? Esp Stickland who’s been knocking about forever

Fwiw I’d certainly have kept Dorsett but him being ‘injury prone’ is not a reason to sign someone else in his position on top.

I think it’s pretty clear we have an imbalance in the squad despite its large numbers. A number of poor decisions were made, not one or two mistakes

[tidus_mi2]

Who is to blame for the poor recruitment? Would think Carey, Hunt and Couhig are the ones to point the finger at but not sure who would be most to blame, was Carey and his team's scouting subpar? Did Hunt ask for these players and was a poor judge? Did Couhig not allow enough funding available to go for primary targets?

[WestYorksRoyal]

Hunt definitely shoulders blame, unfortunately. When asked his ambitions, it was always about good characters. I don't think he had a clear plan on the playing style and identity he wanted, and that meant the club didn't have a clear recruitment strategy. Imagine Selles were still here - you would know exactly what sort of player to pursue.

So we signed a collection of individuals with good pedigree on paper, and it's not working for many of them. Plus our club don't know how to keep players fit.

[Extended-Phenotype]

Positionally speaking, we appeared to do a good job at patching up where we needed players. I'd argue the majority of those players should be playing better than they have managed, and maybe this is reasonable evidence for Hunt coming up a bit short as manager. It's going to be interesting to see if the likes of Lane, MOM, Doyle, Burns and Kyereewa improve under Leam.

But in general, I don't think anyone has looked terrible - it's more that they have looked a bit lost, lacking in confidence, prone to mistakes and not gelling as a team. Every one of those players have shown flashes of quality, we just need to see more of that without the brainfarts. I'm kinda hopeful that this is something that can be unlocked by the right manager.

[Hound]

Agreed - I don’t think any of them are poor players as such - though Stevens and DK did a good job to change my mind on that against Carlisle

Though I’m critical of the numbers and the profile of the players brought in, it’s understandable we made mistakes

First signings for Hunt and JJ, ever pretty much. Neither had ever had to build a team. I don’t get the impression they were very closely aligned

Carey’s halo has faded plenty imo and I’d be interested to know what input he had. Some of the signings just seemed to be S Hunts dodgy recommendations, not what we needed or blatantly obvious (even I had O Connor down as my number one signing to make before we signed him). Scouting done on whoscored in the cases of Doyle and Fraser

[Snowflake Royal]

Positionally speaking, we appeared to do a good job at patching up where we needed players. I'd argue the majority of those players should be playing better than they have managed, and maybe this is reasonable evidence for Hunt coming up a bit short as manager. It's going to be interesting to see if the likes of Lane, MOM, Doyle, Burns and Kyereewa improve under Leam.

But in general, I don't think anyone has looked terrible - it's more that they have looked a bit lost, lacking in confidence, prone to mistakes and not gelling as a team. Every one of those players have shown flashes of quality, we just need to see more of that without the brainfarts. I'm kinda hopeful that this is something that can be unlocked by the right manager.

Yeah. I think the attempt was good, execution less so. Striker is the weak point in the strategy for me, with it not helping the signing it looks like we got the most wrong was for there (O'Mahoney).

It's all a bit Clement. I think he was trying to fix the right problems in mostly the right way with his signings. He just didn’t get enough of the signings to be a success.

[Clyde1998]

Said Ritchie, Marriott, O'Connor and Williams, I know there have been some injury issues there but these have all looked consistently good when they've played.

Agree about the loan signings, dunno if it's poor recruitment or bad luck but they aren't doing well enough and I'd rather we not waste time hoping these guys become good and send them back, let their own clubs deal with them. Maybe keep Jacob due to LB being an issue this season and maybe we're potentially having a look at him for a transfer.

But freeing up loan spaces to have another look at the market in January can only be a good thing. Think MoM and Burns have been the biggest disappointments, was expecting a lot more from them.

I think Burns has done alright - looked better playing along side Williams than anyone else (not surprising when thinking about experience).

Had a look at his time at Stevenage, where he played regularly a couple of years back in this division, and it appears they were playing him as a defensive midfielder; not as a centre-back! Might help explain why he's made some basic mistakes this season.

[Snowflake Royal]

Said Ritchie, Marriott, O'Connor and Williams, I know there have been some injury issues there but these have all looked consistently good when they've played.

Agree about the loan signings, dunno if it's poor recruitment or bad luck but they aren't doing well enough and I'd rather we not waste time hoping these guys become good and send them back, let their own clubs deal with them. Maybe keep Jacob due to LB being an issue this season and maybe we're potentially having a look at him for a transfer.

But freeing up loan spaces to have another look at the market in January can only be a good thing. Think MoM and Burns have been the biggest disappointments, was expecting a lot more from them.

I think Burns has done alright - looked better playing along side Williams than anyone else (not surprising when thinking about experience).

Had a look at his time at Stevenage, where he played regularly a couple of years back in this division, and it appears they were playing him as a defensive midfielder; not as a centre-back! Might help explain why he's made some basic mistakes this season.

I think Burns looks one of the weakest loans to be honest.

[Clyde1998]

We’re not a charity. If Ryan or Stickland aren’t going to play then they should not have had contracts. Dorsett likewise if we assume injury prone. Yiadom, much as I like him also. We also have Clarke as a non playing LB/CB. Add in JOP who I forgot as a mini winger, that’s at least 6/7 contracts that could have been better used. That’s before we look at Camara and DK, Rushesha etc

Fraser was being played ahead of savage and Wing. Maybe he is best as a DM but that’s not where he was being played

It's all very easy in hindsight Hound.

Yiadom has proved a good decision, he looks fit and is playing well.

Dorsett looks a good decision. He's playing ok, giving depth and covering two positions.

Have we got them all right? No. But remember, at the time a lot of the renewals happened we basically didn't have a squad. There's an element of getting bodies in not knowing what quality we'd secure later.

Extending Ryan, JOP, Rushesha, Stickland etc are not exactly big costs.

Maybe not but were they only signed as worst case they’d play if we could sign anyone else?

As I edited in the post, signing them meant we didn’t need to sign who we did and should have concentrated our efforts elsewhere - mainly DM and CF. Just smacks of confusion and uncertainty renewing them but not trusting them

Rushesha is 23, Stickland and Ryan near 22. JOP 23 I think. Are we still unsure about them at this age? Esp Stickland who’s been knocking about forever

Fwiw I’d certainly have kept Dorsett but him being ‘injury prone’ is not a reason to sign someone else in his position on top.

I think it’s pretty clear we have an imbalance in the squad despite its large numbers. A number of poor decisions were made, not one or two mistakes

JOP's 20, coming up to 21, according to the date of birth listed on the club's website: https://www.readingfc.co.uk/academy/gra ... ine-peters

There was an article put in the academy thread as to what's likely going on with these players (and backs up what I've been saying about getting players out on loan): https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... e-for-them

Take control of your future
Released at 21 but with a CV boasting a contract in a Premier League or Championship club. That can appear to be a promising start to a career. In fact, it is quite the opposite. Sitting in an under-21 team, competing almost exclusively against other under-21 teams, is hindering your career. Here is the strategy players and clubs should employ. If a player receives a professional contract at the age of 18, they should spend one season in the under-21 squad, then, unless they are playing regularly for the first team, leave on loan to play when mortgages are on the line.

Players in my study who took advantage of a loan before they reached the age of 21 lengthened their career, on average, by two years. There were 167 players in my study who got a professional contract. These players moved, on average, five times in their first five years, and two of those moves were loans. Notwithstanding the recognition and pride that come with turning up to a state-of-the-art training centre and walking past pictures of successful players who have forged life-changing careers in the game, the name of the game is minutes.

Go on loan and show the world what you can do. Show the world you can play in men’s football. Many clubs will, quite happily, keep most of the 1,000-plus players in their under-21s because they need to fulfil fixtures, but this does not help the player.

There will be anxiety. I work with players who are worried about geographical moves and short-term contracts, but by showing players and clubs this data, they can prepare for it. Life begins at the edge of your comfort zone. An under-21 contract of £2,000 a week is appealing, but if both player and club want the player to progress, spending three seasons playing under-21 football is thoughtless.

A lot of these players are being kept in the squad to help fulfil U21 matches, whilst allowing us some depth when it comes to injuries, sudden sales, etc.

I think English football should be looking at going back to a reserve team model beyond the age of eighteen to cut down on the number of players each club is having to employ to fulfil fixtures (as you'd have more of an ability to play older players) and give greater scope for players to go out on loan.

[Hound]

Yes JOP is a bit weird because there are lots of decent websites claiming he is 23 or 24. I’d never seen him as only 20 until that link you sent

If he is only 20 then can give him a bit more leeway certainly

[Brogue]

Voted none. Not been impressed with any of them tbh